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View Full Version : Meeting #11: The Mind of Morrison



JohnLees
Tuesday, August 11, 2009, 02:16 AM
Hey clubbers! It’s been a week longer than usual between meetings, what with me being off to San Diego and all that, so I’ll try and make this installment worth the wait. Let’s get right to it then: Grant Morrison. He’s a writer who seems to starkly divide comic book fans. Some dismiss him as a pretentious nut that is unable to form a coherent narrative. But others, myself included, would rank him as one of the undisputed geniuses of the comic book medium. Whatever side of the fence you happen to fall on, it’s hard not to have a strong opinion of him one way or the other, as evidenced by the response to both Batman RIP and Final Crisis last year.

Those who hated them, really hated them, and the fanboy backlash in some circles has been so derisive that we’ve seen a number of DC representatives all but apologize for the stories and acknowledge both as failures. And I don’t think that’s fair at all. The biggest perceived problem with these stories is exactly what I feel is their big strength: that they refuse to play by the expected conventions of an “event comic”. I’ve often said the worst thing about both Batman RIP and Final Crisis is their titles, as they might have given readers the wrong idea about what to expect. Batman might not actually die in Batman RIP, but what we do get is a fascinating deconstruction (and ultimately, a celebration) of everything that makes Batman who he is, with Morrison finding new, exciting things to say about a character who has been around for 70 years. And while Final Crisis may not play out like your usual DC Crisis, and failed to match the sales of Marvel’s competing event, Secret Invasion, I think creatively speaking Final Crisis was far superior, because while Secret Invasion was simply more of the same, Final Crisis played out almost like an “anti-event”, following familiar beats but coming at them from an unorthodox direction. All Morrison was doing was thinking outside the box, creating something a bit more ambitious and challenging than the usual, but a lot of readers just couldn’t handle it – “What’s going on? It doesn’t make any sense! WHERE DOES THIS FIT IN CONTINUITY!?!?” I, for one, had little trouble following either story, and I think that, with an open mind and a little contextual grounding, both make perfect sense. Nevertheless, Final Crisis and Batman RIP – and the response to them - showcased the tension between the classic and the experimental that has characterized much of Morrison’s work, and which will be a recurring focus of today’s meeting.

In putting together the reading list for this meeting, I wanted to get a good spread of texts covering different facets of Grant Morrison’s writing. I also wanted to try, as much as I could, to only use complete works here, hence the exclusion of the likes of Doom Patrol or The Invisibles. Morrison is very much a longform writer, his narratives often taking time to generate a meaning which doesn’t become clear until the conclusion. As such, I felt it would be more beneficial to look at graphic novels that featured his self-contained stories, rather than those that are individual volumes of larger works. My aim for this meeting is to look at a selection of Morrison’s original Vertigo projects – The Filth, Kill Your Boyfriend, WE3 - using them to identify the recurring themes and motifs running through Morrison’s work, before studying his Eisner-gobbling hit All Star Superman and examining how much Morrison’s unique voice remains present on a mainstream project with the most iconic of superheroes.

I’m going to start by looking at The Filth, which, from my personal reading experience, is the most “Morrisonesque” of all his comics (at least all his American work) - Grant Morrison storytelling in its purest, most unfiltered form. I fear for the readers who thought Batman RIP made no sense, because The Filth would make their heads explode. It plays like a Morrison greatest hits album, touching on most of Morrison’s favorite things: altered states, universes within universes, mad science, spiritualism, sexual deviancy, animal welfare, transvestitism, people in gimp masks, comic book characters escaping the confines of their fictional worlds, and stacks of mind-bending drugs. So, the implication is that this is Morrison at his most unfettered, able to tell whatever story he wants, meaning that it could be informative to look at what kind of story this is, exactly.

One thing that is striking is the utterly pessimistic tone that dominates the graphic novel. Don’t get me wrong, it’s not all doom and gloom – many parts are laugh-out-loud hilarious. But that doesn’t change the fact that the world as presented here is totally miserable, morally bankrupt, just about devoid of any redeeming qualities. The world sucks, life sucks, and more than anything else, people suck, as snippets of dialogue like this regularly remind us:


They crucified a fireman and used his bravery medals to put out his eyes…I…I watched little kids and women fighting over a human heart. And…my own wife went with them willingly, dancing and hollering like a wild thing. That’s why I need therapy.


That line comes in Chapter 8: ^*%$ Police, following on from the events of Chapter 7: Zero Democracy, where recurring antagonist Spartacus Hughes turns a utopian mobile city into a hellish nest of bloodthirsty savages in a twisted kind of social experiment. This could be viewed as a microcosm for Morrison’s view on humanity as a whole, especially since the protagonist – the weak-willed, porn-loving Greg Feely/Ned Slade – does little to showcase the better side of the human race. Even the idealized vision of the comic book superhero isn’t exempt from this corruption, as seen by the deterioration of Secret Original, a noble superhero who found his way into the “real world” of The Filth. Not only is he left a physical wreck by the shift, his twisted, gnarled body confined to a wheelchair, but he has become bitter and debauched upon discovering the nature of his prior existence, as seen in Chapter 3: Structures and Ultrastructures:


I see the cruel reality behind all our hopes and dreams now. I know us for what we truly are, Not supermen but super-slaves in a synthetic prison. Playing out crummy meaningless adventures written by amoral monsters. They farm us, Eve; they farm us for the wonders we simply accept in our ignorance.


I find the whole subplot of Moog Mercury and his expeditions into the fictional comic book world to be fascinating. On the surface, it has little to do with the main storyline, but look closer and you can see how it helps illuminate everything else in the book. Whenever Mercury’s team enters the “paperverse”, they need to rewrite the fictional universe around the alterations they’ve made (“We’ll fix it all in the next continuity update.”), which makes them sound a bit like comic book writers, constantly tinkering with their worlds and fixing errors or outdated elements through retcons and retellings. When looking at The Filth as a whole with this in mind, the whole graphic novel starts to feel like a commentary on writing comics, with dense continuity and rampant death/rebirth taking to cartoonish extremes. Look even at the recurrence of the term “status quo” – the comic book Mercury routinely raids is called Status Quorum, the group Slade/Feely finds himself working for is called Status Q. In the chaos of The Filth, we see the chaos of superhero comics: fantastic worlds of unlimited possibility, where anything can happen, constantly in struggle with the need to maintain status quo.

Though he does it in varied, highly unconventional ways, Grant Morrison often returns to the idea of writing comics about comics, exploring the ways in which stories are told, and experimenting with the format. We’ll return to that later, but right now I want to return to my earlier quote from Secret Original, who describes comic book writers as “amoral monsters”. Is Grant Morrison an amoral writer? I think when exploring this tension between cult and mainstream, this question of morality is important. We are, after all, looking at a medium built on a genre dealing with good triumphing over evil on the grandest of scales. The Filth seems to be a book with little in the way of moral grounding or belief in basic human goodness. But both are utterly absent in Kill Your Boyfriend, a graphic novella that is more straightforward and less ambitious than The Filth, yet manages to be even more potent in its nihilism.

Kill Your Boyfriend is Grant Morrison’s version of a classic love story. Girl meets boy. Girl gets boy to murder her boyfriend. Girl and boy run away together, murdering old people and breaking into their houses. Girl has wild sex with boy, and experiments with a variety of drugs. Girl and boy get on a bus full of social misfits, engaging in countercultural philosophical discussions and more sexual experimentation. Girl and boy go on a crime spree, and desecrate a corpse. Girl and boy go on run from the police. Boy gets shot and fatally wounded, but manages to blow himself and several police officers to smithereens in his last dying act. Girl grows up, gets married and has kids, but merrily feeds her family small portions of rat poison to slowly kill them. Oh, and though they never realize it themselves, we discover that boy and girl were actually long lost brother and sister. And they all lived happily ever after!

There is little in the way of explanation behind the horrible actions committed by the protagonists, other than boredom, and there isn’t a single character in the book that isn’t a fraud, a hypocrite, a scumbag or a pervert, if not all of the above. In the afterword at the end of the graphic novel, Morrison cites the film Badlands, the myth of Dionysus and the frenzy he drove women to, and the plays of Joe Orton as inspirations for Kill Your Boyfriend, but the most telling comment comes in the afterword’s closing paragraph:


Kill Your Boyfriend was my first love story, straight from the heart, and I love it still. Like a favorite record, it retains the power to conjure for me a certain time, certain places and the way it felt to be there at that time, in those places.


Again, this casts a nightmarish, amoral tableau in the light of being a commentary on society as a whole, in this case Morrison’s microcosm of 1990s Britain. Between Kill Your Boyfriend and The Filth, it would be fair to ponder if Grant Morrison sees any hope or goodness in the world.

That brings us to WE3. Given the anarchic, nihilistic nature of the other graphic novels discussed so far, WE3 is almost a sentimental bedtime story by comparison. It’s basically Homeward Bound with guns and a much, much higher bodycount. Morrison shows his versatility here (and his softer side too), for while the previous two stories were about challenging our brains, here the focus is on tugging at our heart-strings. Upon reading a little about the plot, and given my prior knowledge of Grant Morrison’s Vertigo work, I thought I knew what to expect from WE3. Innocent animals become victims of cruel humanity, are turned into monsters, and of course, they die in the end. But the story played against my expectations, on several levels.

While other sample texts relished showing the hidden ugliness at the core of their characters, here many characters show surprising moments of human decency, even in initially unlikeable characters. Roseanne Berry is introduced as one of the doctors who participated in this horrific procedure that transformed three kidnapped house pets – a dog (1, or Bandit), a cat (2, or Tinker) and a rabbit (3, or Pirate) – into cyborg killing machines, so we expect a monster. Instead, she shows remorse for what she has done, setting the animals free and ultimately sacrificing her life to protect them. We assume the homeless person who discovers the animals is going to give them up to the military, but instead he defies the authorities and refuses to help them kill the trio. And Dr. Trendle, the scientist who masterminded these cruel experiments and who oversees the pursuit of the animals after their escape, shows unexpected integrity at the end of the book, testifying in court to bring down the senator bankrolling the initiative, and showing kindness to the dog, the cat, and the homeless man looking after them. With the utter moral decay of The Filth and Kill Your Boyfriend, these small moments suggest that humanity is not completely devoid of redeeming qualities.

As for the cruelty these animals have been subjected to turning them into monsters, that isn’t quite the case here. Yes, physically their appearances become monstrous. And yes, they kill scores of soldiers with ruthless efficiency at the close of the first chapter, before 1 and 2 kill a violently protective father and his dog respectively at the end of the second chapter. But while both The Filth and Kill Your Boyfriend play with the notion that all it takes is a little push to turn “normal” people into bloodthirsty animals, the animals in WE3 remain innocent even after all they’ve done and all they’ve been put through, as seen by 1’s instinctive desire to protect humans from harm – “Gud dog! Help man.”

And finally, we come to the expectation that these poor animals are inevitably doomed to die. I should explain that animal cruelty is something of an Achilles heel to me. I can happily watch people get killed in movies all day, but I find killing a dog deeply upsetting. I blubbed like a schoolgirl watching that Futurama episode with Fry’s dog. So, when the first chapter closes with the exposition of “They can’t survive more than a few days without their medication”, followed by 1’s expression of his simple, singular desire - “Home” - I could already feel a lump in my throat, my prediction for the book’s ending apparently confirmed. As the story progresses, 3 is first wounded, then killed, leaving 1 and 2, sick and near death. On page 29 of Chapter 3, as the dying Bandit struggles to cope with the concept of death – “Is black far where, is where b “Bandit”?” – it seems the tearjerker ending has arrived. But then at the 11th hour, Bandit and Tinker are rescued by the homeless man, and taken into his care, where they recover and are restored into a normal, healthy dog and cat. Amazingly, we are given a happy ending.

And so, despite its fair share of bleak moments, WE3 ultimately stands as an optimistic, perhaps even uplifting graphic novel. Thematically, it’s starkly different from the other Morrison texts we’ve looked at thus far, but does that make it less of a “Grant Morrison comic”? I don’t think so, because though he frequently returns to it, all the amorality, sexual deviance and the like isn’t the most important thing about Morrison’s work. Rather, it’s the exploration of the comic book medium, the experimentation with the format, toying with its conventions, pushing at its boundaries, and celebrating what makes it unique. And though the way he does this is different in WE3, this experimentation is still very much present.

In WE3, Morrison lets frequent artistic collaborator Frank Quitely do much of the work on this front. This is very much an artist’s book, with extensive passages featuring no dialogue at all – we don’t get a single line until page 14. And when we do have dialogue, it’s often coming from animals with only rudimentary conversational skills, meaning it’s scattered, often gibberish. But it’s still Morrison writing the scripts, meaning it’s a creative choice to leave so much of the story up to the artist. Here, Morrison is testing the limits of comic books as a visual medium. For the clearest example of this, just look at pages 20-25, where each page boasts a formidable 18 panel grid!

So, when looking at The Filth, Kill Your Boyfriend and WE3 together, and trying to figure out what is the recurring theme uniting all three, this idea of pushing the boundaries is what emerges for me. The Filth pushes the boundaries of narrative, Kill Your Boyfriend pushes the boundaries of taste, and WE3 pushes the boundaries of visual storytelling. And so we get the sense that this is what Grant Morrison is primarily interested in – testing the limits of what a comic book is capable of, doing new and unusual things with the medium. So, bearing all this in mind, what made Grant Morrison the perfect candidate to tell what has already become a definitive, classic story about, of all things, Superman?

In part 7 of Newsarama’s 10-part retrospective interview with Grant Morrison about All Star Superman, “All Star Memories”, Grant Morrison explains how he and Frank Quitely decided to approach the story in its formative stages:


As I’ve mentioned before, I keep this aspect of my job fresh for myself by changing my writing style to suit the project, the character or the artist... The subject matter drives the execution. And then, of course, the artists add their own vision and nuance. With All Star Superman, “Frank” and I were able to spend a lot of time together talking it through, and we agreed it had to be about grids, structure, storybook panel layouts, an elegance of form, a clarity of delivery. “Classical” in every sense of the word. The medium, the message, the story, the character, all working together as one simple equation… In honor of the character’s primal position in the development of the superhero narrative, I hoped we could create an “ultimate” hero story, starring the ultimate superhero.


But this aspiration could set up a potential dilemma. Isn’t there an inherent awkwardness in having the definitive take on the definitive superhero be told by a writer known for going against the grain and challenging convention? Morrison says here that he changes his writing to suit the project, but in adapting to write something so different from the kind of material he made his name on, does he risk silencing his own authorial voice and becoming invisible? Does All Star Superman truly stand as a Grant Morrison comic?

Morrison certainly succeeds in his aim to do Superman justice, telling a story which respects and adheres to the Superman mythos. No moral murk here – Superman is the pinnacle of inherent goodness. Indeed, in this age of grim-and-gritty comics, it was almost jarring to see a hero this heroic. For me, the moment that best sums up Morrison’s entire interpretation of Superman throughout the story comes five pages into Chapter 11: Red Sun Day, as Superman, nearing death, looks back on his life:


What a life! I’ve travelled across time and space. I’ve seen and done things beyond imagination. Blessed with friends like Pete and Lana and Jimmy. And Batman… what incredible adventures we’ve shared. What amazing people I’ve known. But Lois, dear Lois… I loved you most of all. And no matter how dark it seems. There’s always a way.


Here is Superman, at the end, with the chance to reflect on all that he is. And what he comes up with is something very human. He just feels lucky to have had the chance to experience such amazing things, and know such wonderful people. And more than any of his incredible powers, what makes him truly super is his never-ending optimism, the ability to always hope for something better – Pa Kent taught him that. Morrison isn’t pushing boundaries here, or subverting convention. This is Superman boiled down to his most traditional, basic appeal, heroism at its most familiar and relatable. And he’s all the more powerful for it.

But just because Morrison chooses not to subvert the Superman mythos doesn’t mean he leaves no authorial imprint on the graphic novel. All Star Superman remains very much a Grant Morrison book. We have the altered states, we have the universes within universes, we have the mad science. We even have Jimmy Olsen engaging in a spot of transvestitism. But the beauty of it is, this isn’t stuff Grant Morrison has pulled out of thin air and forced into an unnatural collision with Superman’s world. No, this is stuff Morrison has gleaned from Superman’s own comic book history, and embellished with the Morrison touch. Chapter 8: Us Do Opposite, reads like the kind of mind-boggling insanity that wouldn’t be out of place in The Filth, yet it merely builds on the Bizarro-World concept that has been around in the comics since the 1960s.

And really, that’s why comic books are the perfect medium for Grant Morrison to work in. Superman is the groundstone, the foundation upon which the entire superhero genre was built, and woven into his history is the very kind of pulpy, psychedelic, high-concept Big Ideas that Morrison has long been attracted to. In the world of comic books, anything is possible. And Morrison sets out to prove that, to celebrate it, time after time in each of his projects. I’ll wrap up with a quote from Morrison himself, this one from Part 6 of the “All Star Memories” interviews, where he attempts to sum up in his own words what drives him to write:

We live in the stories we tell ourselves. It’s really simple. We can continue to tell ourselves and our children that the species we belong to is a crawling, diseased, viral cancer smear, only fit for extinction, and let’s see where that leads us. We can continue to project our self-loathing and narcissistic terror of personal mortality onto our culture, our civilization, our planet, until we wreck the promise of the world for future generations in a fit of sheer self-induced panic... or we can own up to the scientific fact that we are all physically connected as parts of a single giant organism, imagine better ways to live and grow...and then put them into practice. We can stop pissing about, start building starships, and get on with the business of being adults… My own work has been an ongoing attempt to repeat the magic word over and over until we all become the kind of superheroes we’d all like to be.


Meeting 12
Next time, we’re going to take a look at the history of horror in comics. How has the genre evolved over the decades? What techniques did comic creators use to scare their readers 50 years ago, and how do they differ from the techniques being used now? And the big one – is it even possible to be scared by a comic book, or is it an inherently ineffective medium for horror?

RECOMMENDED READING:

The EC Archives: Tales from the Crypt, Volume 1
Al Feldstein and Johnny Craig, Bill Fraccio, George Roussos, Wally Wood, Harvey Kurtzman, Graham Ingels, Jack Kamen

Uzumaki, Volume 1
Junji Ito

The Walking Dead: Days Gone Bye
Robert Kirkman and Tony Moore

Wrath of the Spectre
Michael Fleisher and Jim Aparo


Meeting 13
Open Forum – I need to give you some advance notice for this one, as you’ll probably need a good amount of lead-time to get the reading done. I want you to go out and buy the DC Showcase or Marvel Essential volume of your choice, and get to work on reading it!

tiggerpete
Tuesday, August 11, 2009, 09:27 AM
so....Morrison...........Awesome! ever since I read his run on JLA, I have been a Morrison fan, but I have not read much of any of his pre-JLA works, other than Arkham Asylum (kicks so much ass it should be illegal [psychological ass, not physical ass]). I did like Seven Soldiers though, even if it took a while to develop, and since he was one of the all-star writers to work on 52, I have been snatching up anything he writes anymore. I thought FC was better than RIP, mostly because of the grand scope of it, and how it fit as a "Final Crisis" because it can not be topped, it was a fight against existence itself, and would have ended everything if it had gone through. (you could argue the same with some previous Crisis', but none had the scale and scope of FC) long story short, Morrison is a freakin' genius. (not my favorite writer right now, but definitely in my top three) (Geoff Johns, Grant Morrison, and Greg Rucka are my current top three in that order if you were curious)

Dungbeetle
Tuesday, August 11, 2009, 10:46 AM
I'll have to check out Kill Your Boyfriend.

The Filth is an odd one, I think everyone gets something different out of it. I actually found the whole affair to be less cold and distant than the Invisibles, maybe because it only really centres around Feely. It divides readers because they either can't get past the fact the protagonist is a sad old pervert, or just see him as some guy who loves his cat. If you can't get beyong the porn thing then you'll have trouble empathising and it doesn't work.

I think you're right about the whole book being about writing, albeit it in a very abstract sense. The money shot where Feely falls, and we see his hand, which reminds of The Hand earlier on, speaks volumes. I'd also venture to say that the different branches of the Hand represent the different areas of censorship our minds put us through every day. So the story's "real world" is for the most part metaphorical. Ultimately every chapter has a micro/macro thing going on; the Skin Desert, the Ship/Country, the iLife Planet.

It's interesting that in the conclusion of the story, Feely (having always been a negotiator) becomes a healer, and goes around acting exactly as the iLife were designed to. To me, there are a lot of positive ideas in this story, and it screams Gaia Theory, although most won't hear it through the general nastiness and sordid tone. I'd also say that, for all its perversion and deviance, the whole story is at its most harrowing in the "real world", for instance, the part where the police are digging up Feely's back yard. That has a really nightmarish quality; ever had a dream where noone believes you?

Doom Patrol is great fun... very silly, reminds me of Delano's early Hellblazer sometimes. Unashamedly brainy but very silly with it in places.

AdamH
Tuesday, August 11, 2009, 02:53 PM
And finally, we come to the expectation that these poor animals are inevitably doomed to die. I should explain that animal cruelty is something of an Achilles heel to me. I can happily watch people get killed in movies all day, but I find killing a dog deeply upsetting. I blubbed like a schoolgirl watching that Futurama episode with Fry’s dog. So, when the first chapter closes with the exposition of “They can’t survive more than a few days without their medication”, followed by 1’s expression of his simple, singular desire - “Home” - I could already feel a lump in my throat, my prediction for the book’s ending apparently confirmed.

First of, all of that above. I had the same reaction to the book, and to that Futurama episode.

Second off, big Morrison fan. And if you want some good early Morrison I suggest his run on "Animal Man" in the 80's. Great stuff, it really took the character and stood it on it's head. Hell it took the whole idea of what a superhero comic book could be for me personally, and blew it out of the water.

LukeHalsall
Wednesday, August 12, 2009, 01:27 PM
I havent managed to get hold of the books for this week again (gutted) but they are on my to do list. till then, i thought i'd just say a little about the man in question.

In my opinion, the man is an absolute genius. there is nothing that i have not read that i did not think was crazy good. the man is such an inspiration to me and if i could be half the writer that he is, i would be happy.

All of his Vertigo books that i have read such as The Invisibles, his run on Animalman and his few Constantine stories just blow you away. Some people might not like him but he makes you think about life. Morrison could have been (and blatantly wants to be) a philosopher for the masses.

In my opinion, if he was born in a different century or had taken up a different profession, universities would be discussing Morrison's theories and ideas.

Let alone that, his work on Batman is just stellar. arkham asylum is a mind blowing rind through the criminal as well as his more recent work on the Bat that as John said deconstructs him in a way that we have not seen before.

What i love about Morrison is that he is not afraid to take risks: we can see this from his early US work where many people may have thought that the mind bending element that he has become famous for was the end of his career as well as 'killing' Batman just to name a few.

I do have a few complaints about Morrison. the main one is that although i think the non linear story line works and in fact is amazing, i can see why people dislike it. many people want to see where they are going with a story and if they are reading a comic book, they may get lost as they have to wait for the next issue to come out. i think, it works perfectly and infact better than most writers when he is writing in a graphic novel where the entire story is there but when we have to wait i can see why people might get confused. i propose therefore that Morrison's great work should only be released in graphic novel form and then fed back to the doubters. i am sure more people would love it then.

The other thing that i am a bit concerned about was one of his British comics from the 1980s. 'The NEw adventures of Hitler'. i have not read it and therefore cannot judge but still sounds a bit dodgy to me.

Overall though, Morrison is a boner fide genius in my view and should be treated as comic book royalty in the same respect as other Brit invasionist like Moore and Gaimen are.

Hoping to get all read up for next time :D

Dungbeetle
Wednesday, August 12, 2009, 04:42 PM
I'd quite like to read the New Adventures of Hitler. Sounds like great fun.

You have to remember the man is also a Crowley fanatic and a fan of anything deviant for it's own sake. I read that he wrote a stage play about Crowley's life... and I view him with higher regard than Gaiman, who works best with existing mythological figures, and, while poetic and thoughtful as a writer, repeatedly fails to be fun.

JohnLees
Thursday, August 13, 2009, 12:51 AM
Potential problem with the next meeting, folks. Upon trying to require Uzumaki and Tales of the Crypt: Volume 1, I've found difficulty with the availability of both. With Uzumaki, I can only find it from specialised traders who are saying delivery could take up to 2 weeks, and with [I]Tales of the Crypt[/I it's out of stock where I've looked, and should it come back in stock you'll be paying north of 20 pounds (or near 40 dollars) for it.

So, while I'm going to try and get Uzumaki at least, don't worry if you can't get these two books. The Wrath of the Spectre and The Walking Dead should be attainable enough, however.

JeffHaas
Thursday, August 13, 2009, 02:12 AM
I will buck the trend on this thread and say that I never really cared for Morrison outside what he did with JLA. It is not due to a lack of knowledge of continuity on my side but more of his story construction. He tends to attempt weirdness and continuity insertions(miracle machine) without respect for the story/plot/ or character at hand.

At times I think he believes weirdness for the sake of it is creativity.

What I liked about JLA was that he made you believe that Superman and Wonderwoman would really ask for the aid of Batman. The weirdness met the scope and tone of the series in a way that felt natural. The same style seems unfit for a character like Batman in his solo tale. Sort of like when Winnick tried to do Green Lantern and Shazam and make them socially relevant.

Nothing personal, just my two cents.

wiegeabo
Thursday, August 13, 2009, 07:06 AM
Potential problem with the next meeting, folks. Upon trying to require Uzumaki and Tales of the Crypt: Volume 1, I've found difficulty with the availability of both. With Uzumaki, I can only find it from specialised traders who are saying delivery could take up to 2 weeks, and with [I]Tales of the Crypt[/I it's out of stock where I've looked, and should it come back in stock you'll be paying north of 20 pounds (or near 40 dollars) for it.

So, while I'm going to try and get Uzumaki at least, don't worry if you can't get these two books. The Wrath of the Spectre and The Walking Dead should be attainable enough, however.


Well, if someone happened to be willing, or needing, to acquire these though somewhat less than strictly typical means...I can hook them up. Just saying, these things are darn near impossible to find... ;)

JohnLees
Friday, August 14, 2009, 04:37 PM
so....Morrison...........Awesome! ever since I read his run on JLA, I have been a Morrison fan, but I have not read much of any of his pre-JLA works, other than Arkham Asylum (kicks so much ass it should be illegal [psychological ass, not physical ass]). I did like Seven Soldiers though, even if it took a while to develop, and since he was one of the all-star writers to work on 52, I have been snatching up anything he writes anymore. I thought FC was better than RIP, mostly because of the grand scope of it, and how it fit as a "Final Crisis" because it can not be topped, it was a fight against existence itself, and would have ended everything if it had gone through. (you could argue the same with some previous Crisis', but none had the scale and scope of FC) long story short, Morrison is a freakin' genius. (not my favorite writer right now, but definitely in my top three) (Geoff Johns, Grant Morrison, and Greg Rucka are my current top three in that order if you were curious)

Solid top three there! :D

One of the many things people ragged on Final Crisis about was that it didn't feel "big" enough. But like you say, the stakes were astronomically high. It's just the unorthodox perspective Morrison used - taking a real ground-level approach for much of the story - that threw some folks off.

JohnLees
Friday, August 14, 2009, 04:45 PM
I'll have to check out Kill Your Boyfriend.

The Filth is an odd one, I think everyone gets something different out of it. I actually found the whole affair to be less cold and distant than the Invisibles, maybe because it only really centres around Feely. It divides readers because they either can't get past the fact the protagonist is a sad old pervert, or just see him as some guy who loves his cat. If you can't get beyong the porn thing then you'll have trouble empathising and it doesn't work.

I think you're right about the whole book being about writing, albeit it in a very abstract sense. The money shot where Feely falls, and we see his hand, which reminds of The Hand earlier on, speaks volumes. I'd also venture to say that the different branches of the Hand represent the different areas of censorship our minds put us through every day. So the story's "real world" is for the most part metaphorical. Ultimately every chapter has a micro/macro thing going on; the Skin Desert, the Ship/Country, the iLife Planet.

It's interesting that in the conclusion of the story, Feely (having always been a negotiator) becomes a healer, and goes around acting exactly as the iLife were designed to. To me, there are a lot of positive ideas in this story, and it screams Gaia Theory, although most won't hear it through the general nastiness and sordid tone. I'd also say that, for all its perversion and deviance, the whole story is at its most harrowing in the "real world", for instance, the part where the police are digging up Feely's back yard. That has a really nightmarish quality; ever had a dream where noone believes you?

Doom Patrol is great fun... very silly, reminds me of Delano's early Hellblazer sometimes. Unashamedly brainy but very silly with it in places.

You're absolutely right about everyone taking something different from The Filth. That's the thing, with this and quite a few of Morrison's works: it's just so dense that you can't possibly hope to cover everything in one column, never mind when only one portion of one column is focused on it. You could probably right a dissertation on all the frenzied ideas jumping around in The Filth.

I do feel I may have underestimated Feely a bit in my original column, as he isn't totally without merit. The very fact that he "loves his cat" provides us with some glimmer of his inner strength. But even when he does try and make some kind of moral stand in the final chapter, it doesn't really get him anywhere. So when I talked about his failure as a protagonist, I don't really think he's a bad guy, or even unsympathetic. Just largely ineffectual, and even passive for a lot of the time.

JohnLees
Friday, August 14, 2009, 04:51 PM
First of, all of that above. I had the same reaction to the book, and to that Futurama episode.

Second off, big Morrison fan. And if you want some good early Morrison I suggest his run on "Animal Man" in the 80's. Great stuff, it really took the character and stood it on it's head. Hell it took the whole idea of what a superhero comic book could be for me personally, and blew it out of the water.

I really like what I've read of Animal Man. That's another book with a strong human element that shows Morrison's versatility, even when playing with themes and ideas he'd refine in later works. We talked a little about Animal Man in the "Birth of Vertigo" meeting, if you're interested in looking at that.


I havent managed to get hold of the books for this week again (gutted) but they are on my to do list. till then, i thought i'd just say a little about the man in question.

In my opinion, the man is an absolute genius. there is nothing that i have not read that i did not think was crazy good. the man is such an inspiration to me and if i could be half the writer that he is, i would be happy.

All of his Vertigo books that i have read such as The Invisibles, his run on Animalman and his few Constantine stories just blow you away. Some people might not like him but he makes you think about life. Morrison could have been (and blatantly wants to be) a philosopher for the masses.

In my opinion, if he was born in a different century or had taken up a different profession, universities would be discussing Morrison's theories and ideas.

Let alone that, his work on Batman is just stellar. arkham asylum is a mind blowing rind through the criminal as well as his more recent work on the Bat that as John said deconstructs him in a way that we have not seen before.

What i love about Morrison is that he is not afraid to take risks: we can see this from his early US work where many people may have thought that the mind bending element that he has become famous for was the end of his career as well as 'killing' Batman just to name a few.

I do have a few complaints about Morrison. the main one is that although i think the non linear story line works and in fact is amazing, i can see why people dislike it. many people want to see where they are going with a story and if they are reading a comic book, they may get lost as they have to wait for the next issue to come out. i think, it works perfectly and infact better than most writers when he is writing in a graphic novel where the entire story is there but when we have to wait i can see why people might get confused. i propose therefore that Morrison's great work should only be released in graphic novel form and then fed back to the doubters. i am sure more people would love it then.

The other thing that i am a bit concerned about was one of his British comics from the 1980s. 'The NEw adventures of Hitler'. i have not read it and therefore cannot judge but still sounds a bit dodgy to me.

Overall though, Morrison is a boner fide genius in my view and should be treated as comic book royalty in the same respect as other Brit invasionist like Moore and Gaimen are.

Hoping to get all read up for next time :D

LOL, "boner fide".... :p

Lot of good points. I definitely agree that Morrison does the kind of work that academic circles would be drooling over if it wasn't being done in comic books. Which shows the unfortunate stigma which still hangs over much of the medium. Maybe in future centuries university students will be writing on Morrison...

LukeHalsall
Friday, August 14, 2009, 06:38 PM
Maybe in future centuries university students will be writing on Morrison...

Thatd b awesome. anyone got a tardis so we can jump to the future to do the course. Yeah tis gutting that the stigma of comics exists. I wonder whether it will ever go away

tiggerpete
Sunday, August 16, 2009, 08:50 AM
well, if you have an open minded Lit professor, you already can write papers on comics. (I did last semester)

JohnLees
Sunday, August 23, 2009, 08:05 PM
I will buck the trend on this thread and say that I never really cared for Morrison outside what he did with JLA. It is not due to a lack of knowledge of continuity on my side but more of his story construction. He tends to attempt weirdness and continuity insertions(miracle machine) without respect for the story/plot/ or character at hand.

At times I think he believes weirdness for the sake of it is creativity.

What I liked about JLA was that he made you believe that Superman and Wonderwoman would really ask for the aid of Batman. The weirdness met the scope and tone of the series in a way that felt natural. The same style seems unfit for a character like Batman in his solo tale. Sort of like when Winnick tried to do Green Lantern and Shazam and make them socially relevant.

Nothing personal, just my two cents.

I think it's good there are differing opinions - debate is part of the fun!

I can see what you're saying, and why people might think that. Yes, the weirdness can be overbearing at times, but I don't think it's ever just for the sake of it. I think that the structure always seems to serve the story.

I also really like his take on Batman. Morrison has said that he finds Batman to be less realistic than Superman, as a character. And you can see that mindset in how he approaches him, with the ability to do all the stuff he does without superpowers becoming a kind of superpower in itself.

jamesfairlie
Sunday, August 23, 2009, 11:22 PM
There is a lot about Morrison's writing that I really enjoy, but one of my favourite aspects is very clear in All Star Superman especially: his love of the silver age.
Many writers seem to try and pretend that all the stupid whackyness in the 50s and 60s never happened at all, Morrison however embraces any and all background when writing for a mainstream character. In superman it is particularly clear as almost every issue would seem standard fair in a 50s superman issue. A quick flick through silver age covers would find plenty of the stories he tells here: superman's secret room; superman goes evil; Lois gets powers etc.
This love of the silver age is even more apparent (although a little more under the surface, if that is at all possible) in Batman R.I.P, where Morrison appears to have decided that every Batman story, no matter how out there, actually happened to Bruce Wayne. He even goes so far as to quote text straight out of one of the most crazy stories, "the Batman of Planet X".
What I really love about it though is that it fits into Morrison's own slightly disconnected writing style. If you read it without trying to hold on it ends up making perfect sense, and rereading it things all come together perfectly.
WE3 I enjoyed a lot, but as John said it didn't really feel like a Morrison book, since the lack of dialogue. So although it has a Morrisonish feel to it, it was really Frank Quitely that did the majority of the story telling.
That's all I have to say really: I love the filth, but there's FAR too much to say about it here, and I haven't read kill your boyfriend yet.

wiegeabo
Monday, August 24, 2009, 06:47 AM
Ok, what can I say about Morrison that everyone else hasn't said. Probably nothing. He does seem to be a love him or hate him (or want to hate him) kind of writer. Although I usually hear more love than hate.

For me, sometimes I see Morrison's over-complication and willing to run over all limits as sheer awesome. Other times, I think it's mostly needless. It just depends on the story he's trying to tell, I guess.

For example, I didn't really care for Kill Your Boyfriend. By the time the main characters had run into the artists, I'd lost interest in them. And I'd pretty much lost interest in the story not long after that. The was nothing redeeming about the characters that I could hold onto as, and nothing cool about them that would keep my interest in them as villains or, at the very least, a type of anti-hero. So none of the boundary-pushing Morrison does had any effect on me beyond "ewww, that's odd".

I did take away two bits of social commentary. First, in respect to the girl, it can be seen as a pretty obvious attack at overbearing parents. Basically, the harder you try to hold onto a teenager and control them, the faster they'll slip away. And if you're really a control freak, they might just go out and kill people. What's the lyric from that U2 song? "I'm gonna go crazy if I don't go crazy tonight..." As Thomas Jefferson said, "...a little rebellion, now and then, is a good thing..." Another way to see it is that she's some type of born psychopath (as evidenced by her brother being the same way, and the way she poisons her family at the end). But I find that idea a bit boring and too easy for a Morrison story. Especially when everyone else is also just trying to escape a boring life and live free, or have lived too free and are now overcompensating by living too boring a life (the parents). So Morrison makes one wonder, is the only way to truly live and think free, is to go nuts and actually live by the adage 'live fast, die young, and leave a good looking corpse'?

Secondly, the idea that everyone wears masks and are really sick, twisted, selfish, unrepentant sacks of flesh that don't deserve the life they've been given, and anyone actually worth a damn is few and far between. Now that's classic Morrison right there. But, still, the story didn't do much for me. I didn't really feel anything about the characters (any outrage or other feelings I had at had they acted quickly dies away) except that I wanted them to die , and even that felt hollow and unsatisfying.


Jump to The Filth which is probably the most Morrison thing I've ever read. I've always known that Morrison doesn't believe in boundaries or taboos that shouldn't be crossed. The only time he considers following 'the rules' is when he wants to, and he believes they'll help tell a better, more convincing story (as when he takes on more classic titles like Superman and Batman). But for the first few issues, I had to force myself to keep reading because it was a little too much Morrison. And for the first couple of issues, I trudged on. And then Morrison broke the 4th (and maybe 5th) wall and had the comic characters break out from comics. Now this was something I could latch onto since it caused me to flashback to Morrison's run on Animal Man where he not only had AM see everyone reading his comic, but Grant actually wrote himself into the story and had a philosophical discussion about the nature of existence with the character he was writing. Classic Morrison.

And it seems from that point on, I actually started enjoying reading Filth and wanted to know what happened next. Of course, much (pretty much all) of the stuff happening was sick, twisted, and demented, and yet I actually started caring what was going to happen with Feely. And then, just when Morrion's convinced you that everything you know is wrong, he shows you everything you've just learned is also wrong. In essence, we all become Feely. Mind-****ed (heh, ****ed by the Hand) to first believe in authority, and then rage against it. Often confusing at points, and not in a good way (usually during the jumps between books), I liked reading The Filth much more than KYB.


WE3. Geez, once I realized what this story was about, I was all ready to hate the book and prepared myself for a very depressing read. Do whatever sick, horrific things you want to people, but hurt an animal and I'm ready to walk away (I've only ever watched that one episode of Futurama once, and it's a good thing they fixed it in Bender's Big Score). But then Morrison turns the tables on us, as he always does, and doesn't just show a spark of humanity in the animals, but in the people as well. The bad guys actually get what they deserve and, for the most part, the good guys get a happy ending. With the relative straight-forward story and nearly humane ending, I'd almost think Grant didn't write it. But his fingerprints are all over the structure of the story and artwork. Thank goodness for Morrison's exaggerated violence.


And All-Star Superman is simply a wonderful homage to the Silver Age of DC comics. It's apparent that Morrison loves the Silver Age. And it makes sense when you think about it. In mainstream DC, the comics of that era are probably as close to Morrison-like that you can get. Crazily impossible situations...blurred lines of reality...paradoxes of all types...omnipotent beings wrecking havoc with the status quo... If it wasn't for the censorship that existed back then, I'd think that maybe Grant had been born a few decades too late.

For the first couple of issues, I didn't get this. But then it all suddenly became clear. Everything Morrison was doing fit perfectly into the Silver Age.
Super intelligent scientist doing the impossible - Check
Superman suddenly has crazy new powers - Check
Superman does insanely impressive things that should be impossible even for him - Check
Lois is Superman's girlfriend - Check
Superman reveals his identity - Check
Lois gets powers - Check
Crazy new forms of kryptonite - Check
Superman goes bad - Check
Jimmy gets powers - Check
Lex has a super-sinister plot to kill Superman- Check
Bizarro - Check
Time travel - Check
Supermen of different times with different powers all coming together - Check
Superman ambiguously dying/living in the sun - Check

What in that list hasn't been done, probably multiple times, in Silver Age Superman comics? If Morrison did anything, he transposed classic Silver Age themes into the modern age, with a bit of Morrison flair added in for good measure. This is actually my second time reading All-Star Superman. I didn't get passed Lois's powers the first time because I just didn't get what Morrison was trying to do. Once I realized it was Silver Age Superman in the 21st century, I found myself really enjoying it. It just goes to show that Morrison is talented and versatile enough to write just about anything he wants.

JeffHaas
Monday, August 24, 2009, 02:18 PM
I think it's good there are differing opinions - debate is part of the fun!

I also really like his take on Batman. Morrison has said that he finds Batman to be less realistic than Superman, as a character. And you can see that mindset in how he approaches him, with the ability to do all the stuff he does without superpowers becoming a kind of superpower in itself.

I do understand why Morrison may think this. It may even be accurate. However, ignoring what was done in the 60's, Batman comics do tend to maintain a more realistic tone to their stories. Probably because he is street level. His villains are less powerful, the situations more identifiable. I think Morrison does a disservice to the character by breaking from this. Especially while the character is still trying to escape the 60s stigman in the minds of many.

Additions to the character like the Batman of what ever it was called during the RIP story, is the kind of out of right field, deux ex machina stunt, that leads many to believe that Morrison lacks proper discipline in his story construction. Deux ex machinas are usually considered a sign of weak writing.

tiggerpete
Monday, August 24, 2009, 08:37 PM
while I wasn't a fan of RIP, I could see what he was trying to do, and if you go at it fresh in a collected works so you can see the entire arc, it verges on being ok. It is certainly not the best Batman story out there, and it doesn't do the "fall of Batman" story nearly as good as Knightfall, and it also tends towards incoherent at times, but if you remove "Batman" from the equation, and instead put a less well known character or even an unknown character and put him through all of that, I dare say that most people would have to concede it is a unique story that is unpredictable and sometimes fun.

wiegeabo
Monday, August 24, 2009, 11:29 PM
while I wasn't a fan of RIP, I could see what he was trying to do, and if you go at it fresh in a collected works so you can see the entire arc, it verges on being ok. It is certainly not the best Batman story out there, and it doesn't do the "fall of Batman" story nearly as good as Knightfall, and it also tends towards incoherent at times, but if you remove "Batman" from the equation, and instead put a less well known character or even an unknown character and put him through all of that, I dare say that most people would have to concede it is a unique story that is unpredictable and sometimes fun.

I very much agree with this (loved Knightfall). I felt Batman RIP was hit and miss. Morrison made it needlessly overly-complex and I don't think the Black Hand was really necessary (although you can plainly see Morrison's classic influences in it's members). On the other hand, Morrison writes a brilliantly twisted Joker, and I would have loved to see his take on a final Batman-Joker confrontation to conclude RIP. The thought of the old "Batman can't find Joker's body" bit being turned around into "Joker can't find Batman's body" would have been great to see. And while I think the All-Star Superman homage to the Silver Age was great, Morrison needlessly overdid it in RIP. I thought it was an ok read, but I have little desire to ever reread it, which, for an event this important, strikes me as something being wrong.


I also want to mention Morrison's other big event: Final Crisis. FC completely caught me off guard. I thought the tagline "This time, evil wins" was just another marketing ploy. Oh, no. Evil wins mother****er. I (perhaps perversely) enjoyed the fall of Earth, and how each last stand by the heroes ultimately crumbled. My only problem is that by the end, around the time Morrison's Superman Beyond came out, things started getting too confusing. Morrison had struck a nearly perfect balance before, and sure chaos was supposed to be taking hold in the last moments of the Crisis, but I think Morrison just went a bit too far. I mean, if I hadn't read the Mister Miracle stuff from Seven Soldiers, I wouldn't know what was going on with his part of FC. It didn't ruin the story for me, just left a slightly less than satisfied taste.

JohnLees
Monday, August 24, 2009, 11:59 PM
I also want to mention Morrison's other big even: Final Crisis. FC completely caught me off guard. I thought the tagline "This time, evil wins" was just another marketing ploy. Oh, no. Evil wins. I (perhaps perversely) enjoyed the fall of Earth, and how each last stand by the heroes ultimately crumbled. My only problem is that by the end, around the time Morrison's Superman Beyond came out, things started getting too confusing. Morrison had struck a nearly perfect balance before, and sure chaos was supposed to be taking hold in the last moments of the Crisis, but I think Morrison just went a bit too far. I mean, if I hadn't read the Mister Miracle stuff from Seven Soldiers, I wouldn't know what was going on with his part of FC. It didn't ruin the story for me, just left a slightly less than satisfied taste.

Good points. I've long stated that I loved Final Crisis, right up until the final issue. I loved the pacing of issues 1-6, the way it started at a grubby street level, and just kept on getting bigger and bigger in scale, until we had something so epic it was dizzying. But by the 7th and final issue, you'd expect Morrison to tighten his focus in, and tie everything together in a satisfying conclusion that makes all the disparate threads at play feel unified. Instead, he just keeps making the scale bigger and bigger and bigger, so that rather than being left with any kind of message or statement or conclusion to go home with, his story ends up like Libra in his original JLA appearance - becoming so big and universe-encompassing that it just disperses into nothingness.

tiggerpete
Tuesday, August 25, 2009, 05:26 AM
I also want to mention Morrison's other big event: Final Crisis. FC completely caught me off guard. I thought the tagline "This time, evil wins" was just another marketing ploy. Oh, no. Evil wins mother****er. I (perhaps perversely) enjoyed the fall of Earth, and how each last stand by the heroes ultimately crumbled. My only problem is that by the end, around the time Morrison's Superman Beyond came out, things started getting too confusing. Morrison had struck a nearly perfect balance before, and sure chaos was supposed to be taking hold in the last moments of the Crisis, but I think Morrison just went a bit too far. I mean, if I hadn't read the Mister Miracle stuff from Seven Soldiers, I wouldn't know what was going on with his part of FC. It didn't ruin the story for me, just left a slightly less than satisfied taste.

seven soldiers should be a prerequisite for reading FC, way more of a lead in than Countdown was, because it actually mattered to the story (at least the Mister Miracle part of it)

wiegeabo
Tuesday, August 25, 2009, 05:51 AM
R.I.P and Final Crisis in 5 panels.

(RIP's probably a little more satirical than necessary :p)

RIP (http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/videolinks/linkara/comics-in-5-panels/4923-batman-rip)

FC (http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/videolinks/linkara/comics-in-5-panels/6117-finalc)

tiggerpete
Tuesday, August 25, 2009, 06:05 AM
R.I.P and Final Crisis in 5 panels.

(RIP's probably a little more satirical than necessary :p)

RIP (http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/videolinks/linkara/comics-in-5-panels/4923-batman-rip)

FC (http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/videolinks/linkara/comics-in-5-panels/6117-finalc)

funny, I frequent that site as well, had seen that before, and totally enjoyed the RIP one. (we should start a column on what some of the worst comics out there are and why, it could be really fun) think about it, Amazons Attack, Countdown, One More Day, just to name some of the more recent ones, should spark some great debate too, considering every comic could be someone's favorite for some reason or another, take the Silver Age, most of it is gibberish, campy, and stupid, but some of that is also the same reason people love it, mostly because the simplicity makes things fun due to a lower need to think about what is going on (trust me, thinking about silver age logic can make your head explode) but while being excellent fodder for satire, it is a throwback to a simpler time. still a bad comic column would be a lot of fun.

JeffHaas
Tuesday, August 25, 2009, 01:52 PM
funny, I frequent that site as well, had seen that before, and totally enjoyed the RIP one. (we should start a column on what some of the worst comics out there are and why, it could be really fun) think about it, Amazons Attack, Countdown, One More Day, just to name some of the more recent ones, should spark some great debate too, considering every comic could be someone's favorite for some reason or another, take the Silver Age, most of it is gibberish, campy, and stupid, but some of that is also the same reason people love it, mostly because the simplicity makes things fun due to a lower need to think about what is going on (trust me, thinking about silver age logic can make your head explode) but while being excellent fodder for satire, it is a throwback to a simpler time. still a bad comic column would be a lot of fun.

You can't forget Walt Simonson's run on Hawkgirl..the Maw?

Or the Aquaman one from issue 50 onward.

tiggerpete
Tuesday, August 25, 2009, 07:07 PM
can't say I have read those, but I have read a lot of silver age, we should at least get a forum thread about this going where we can talk more in depth.

wiegeabo
Tuesday, August 25, 2009, 07:13 PM
funny, I frequent that site as well, had seen that before, and totally enjoyed the RIP one. (we should start a column on what some of the worst comics out there are and why, it could be really fun) think about it, Amazons Attack, Countdown, One More Day, just to name some of the more recent ones, should spark some great debate too, considering every comic could be someone's favorite for some reason or another, take the Silver Age, most of it is gibberish, campy, and stupid, but some of that is also the same reason people love it, mostly because the simplicity makes things fun due to a lower need to think about what is going on (trust me, thinking about silver age logic can make your head explode) but while being excellent fodder for satire, it is a throwback to a simpler time. still a bad comic column would be a lot of fun.

You know, what Linkara says at the end of the FC vid is true. Many times when reading Morrison you feel like you've accidentally flipped two pages at the same time. He so frequently jumps from one situation to something completely different with no sense of transition.

I especially came across this while reading the Filth. Two or three times, I was actually convinced I skipped an entire book. Each time I had to check the covers to make sure I hadn't.

tiggerpete
Tuesday, August 25, 2009, 07:24 PM
Morrison is such a genius, he can't be limited to our primitive "narration" and "plot progression" he transcends all of that, maybe if there was a FC motion comic, we could get a feature that bridges the gaps between the pannels with what Grant is actually thinking.